My Middle Sh Aoc Swordstarts with Hotkeys

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Arntzen
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My Middle Sh Aoc Swordstarts with Hotkeys

Post by Arntzen »

I figured after telling alot of newer EE players how I do my swordstart, that posting it here may help others too. I learned the rush start when I was in MiddleWarriors and played Mid on EEC many years ago, the boomstart I've picked up playing alot with good players on AOC.
I mainly got 2 swordstarts, 1 rush and 1 boom. Rushstart is for killing or slowing down enemie as fast as possible. Boomstart is for holding a rush, and win later in the game.

Rush:
- In my civ i got:
Infantry - Sword: Attack, Build Time Decrease, Cost Reduction, Hit Points and Speed
Civ - Economy: Hunt and Foraging and Iron Mining
Civ - Bldgs, Walls & Towers: Build Time Decrease and Cost Reduction
Siege Weapons & Mobile AA - Range
Citizens & Fishing boats: Speed

- Building Orders:
1. Press H, hold shift and press C (buy 5 citz). Then rally to the closest hippo.
2. Press tab, hold shift and press tap 5 times more and send the citz to the nearest iron mine.
3. Press tab, hold shift and press tap 5 times more and send the citz to the next iron mine.
4. Pick Civ
5. Press tab, hold shift and press tap again then press B (build 1 barrack with 2 citz).
6. Press tab, hold shift and press tap 2 times, then press B (build 1 barrack with 3 citz).
7. Press tab, hold shift and press tap 2 times, then press B (build 1 barrack with 3 citz).
8. Choose 1 cit from each iron mine to build 1 settlement each.
9. Buy Swordsmen and hold control+1 (so you can easly buy new swordsmen, just press 1 then S).
10. Lure 2 hippos with the citz that pops out of the Capitol.
11. use the 8 citz to buy 3 towers (always start building tower on the iron mine you think is in most danger).
12. When towers are done, send 6 to forage and 2 to wood.

Remember to get as many citz you possibly can, and ATTACK as fast and as hard as you can in the start. (No point of doing this start if you dont attack)

Boom:
The idea of this strat is to be able to hold a rush and after a while easly win because I got more economy to use on army. Its not to sit on my as the whole game and boom, but attack and win in around 20-40f11.

- In my Civ i got:
Infantry - Sword: Attack, Build Time Decrease, Cost Reduction, Hit Points and Speed
Civ - Economy: Farming
Civ - Bldgs, Walls & Towers: Cost Reduction
Spesial Powers: Expansionism
Siege Weapons & Mobile AA - Range

- Build orders:
1. Press H, hold shift and press C (buy 5 citz). Then rally to the wood.
2. Press tab, hold shift and press tap 5 times more and send the citz to iron mine nearest the forage.
2. Press tab, hold shift and press tap 5 times more and send the citz to forage.
3. Press tab, hold shift and press tap 3 times more and send the citz to wood.
4. Pick Civ
5. Press tab, hold shift and press tap 2 times then press B (buy 1 barrack with 3 citz)
6. Press tab, hold shift and press tap 2 times then press B (buy 1 barrack with 3 citz)
7. Choose 2 citz on iron to make Town Center.
8. Choose 2 citz on forage to make Town Center.
9. Buy Swordsmen and hold control + 1 (so you can easly buy new swordsmen, just press 1 then S).
10. Then make as many citz, 3 towers and 4 houses as fast as you possible can.

Remember to never stop making citz (use both TC and the Capitol), make 2 farms fast. Start on 2 new iron mines and make as much barracks around ur base as you can (both defence and you get faster Swords). And make a temple for Gods sake! (Too many people have died because of a firestorm when they Sword Boom).

I hope this helps, and please leave a comment on what you think of both my civs and my starts! : D
Last edited by Arntzen on Thu Feb 25, 2010 8:07 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: My Middle Sh Aoc Swordstarts with Hotkeys

Post by taco »

advanced minning. never seen that in a slut civ b4 essecially when ur only using 10 cits on iron at start(not that it would help anymore if u had 14 since u produce constantly 3 swords with about 10-12 on iron+ ups on swords). unless its part of some big late game plan of urs. id trade it in for seige range & cit hp. so u can hold off their slut and have a trick card for later game.

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Re: My Middle Sh Aoc Swordstarts with Hotkeys

Post by Arntzen »

I am useing 12 citz on iron from start:
"Press tab, hold shift and press tap 5 times more" = 1+5 = 6
And im having trouble getting enough iron to make swords constantly.
but thx, ill probably use cit hp and seige range in the future!
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Re: My Middle Sh Aoc Swordstarts with Hotkeys

Post by taco »

do u feed ur mines? if u do and dont get enough iron at start there is something wrong with the way u play

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Re: My Middle Sh Aoc Swordstarts with Hotkeys

Post by Omega »

http://save-ee.com/viewtopic.php?f=59&t=868

Very similar to the start I use to teach people.

I will say there is a lot of room for optimization in that start (and yours too), but it will complicate your build order significantly in terms of APM and in terms of dividing your focus (still worth it, IMO).

You don't need Advanced Mining. Ditch it for 6 "free" points that can go to much more useful things.

Siege range is very good in games that have a tendency to last, especially as the player count increases.
Siege cost isn't bad in a small-player scenario (think 1v1, 2v2), where you might have a very strong desire to produce rams and/or heavy siege towers to end it faster.
Citizen Hit Points is good for obvious reasons--Speed too.

Generally, I'll pair Siege Range + Citizen Speed for 2v2, 3v3, and 4v4 games, and go with Cit HP + Siege Cost for 1v1 games, but there's really no reason you couldn't go with Siege Range + Citizen HP + Random 1 point bonus if you felt so inclined.

If you're having iron difficulties, I'd strongly suggest hotkeying the 6 citizens on each iron mine, and focusing on sending the first group of citizens to the 2nd furthest iron from your base, and the second group to the closest iron. Get a good feel for early returning with hotkeys+mouse and then immediately swapping to barracks and hitting S when you have the 72 iron needed. On the average map, you should be able to produce swords non-stop once you get the barracks up, with zero gap time where you're waiting for iron. On exceptionally poor maps, you should only have some gap time after the first 3, and never after that (in which case, you should really be using ctrl+b and making swords at individual barracks to still keep production to maximum level, even if it's not even across your 3 barracks--and don't ever wait intentionally to even it up).
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Re: My Middle Sh Aoc Swordstarts with Hotkeys

Post by Arntzen »

I remember reading urs (Omega) swordstart, but I wanted to put my start out here with exactly how I use the hotkeys so players easlyer can understand how to use them.

The swordrush start are pretty standard yes, and the swordrush civ is the same for all except the 6 free points. Tho you guys havent really said anything about my boom start. Does it sound okey or is it crap? You got any tips or hints on what can make it better? Tell me please, im open for any opinion!
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Re: My Middle Sh Aoc Swordstarts with Hotkeys

Post by taco »

personally from what uv shown us( which isnt much at all, 2f11 if that) i dont c much wrong with, im a huge hunting fanatic which gives u points from me on ur boom civ. get a 2nd iron mine fairly early and focus on massing swords over cit booming(although u should b able to constantly do both with at least 2 tcs and rax's working nonstop). if u have a good herd. go for a 3rd rax. u proboboly already no and do all of this. its just u only stated the very start of the game. im sure i can critise ur boom alot more if u give me 10f11 lol.

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Re: My Middle Sh Aoc Swordstarts with Hotkeys

Post by devilridermax »

taco wrote: im sure i can critise ur boom alot more if u give me 10f11 lol.
im sure we could all poke sticks at yours to F%@#^$ kid

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Re: My Middle Sh Aoc Swordstarts with Hotkeys

Post by devilridermax »

Kazter wrote:I figured after telling alot of newer EE players how I do my swordstart, that posting it here may help others too. I learned the rush start when I was in MiddleWarriors and played Mid on EEC many years ago, the boomstart I've picked up playing alot with good players on AOC.
I mainly got 2 swordstarts, 1 rush and 1 boom. Rushstart is for killing or slowing down enemie as fast as possible. Boomstart is for holding a rush, and win later in the game.

Rush:
- In my civ i got:
Infantry - Sword: Attack, Build Time Decrease, Cost Reduction, Hit Points and Speed
Civ - Economy: Hunt and Foraging and Iron Mining
Civ - Bldgs, Walls & Towers: Build Time Decrease and Cost Reduction
Siege Weapons & Mobile AA - Range
Citizens & Fishing boats: Speed

- Building Orders:
1. Press H, hold shift and press C (buy 5 citz). Then rally to the closest hippo.
2. Press tab, hold shift and press tap 5 times more and send the citz to the nearest iron mine.
3. Press tab, hold shift and press tap 5 times more and send the citz to the next iron mine.
4. Pick Civ
5. Press tab, hold shift and press tap again then press B (build 1 barrack with 2 citz).
6. Press tab, hold shift and press tap 2 times, then press B (build 1 barrack with 3 citz).
7. Press tab, hold shift and press tap 2 times, then press B (build 1 barrack with 3 citz).
8. Choose 1 cit from each iron mine to build 1 settlement each.
9. Buy Swordsmen and hold control+1 (so you can easly buy new swordsmen, just press 1 then S).
10. Lure 2 hippos with the citz that pops out of the Capitol.
11. use the 8 citz to buy 3 towers (always start building tower on the iron mine you think is in most danger).
12. When towers are done, send 6 to forage and 2 to wood.

Remember to get as many citz you possibly can, and ATTACK as fast and as hard as you can in the start. (No point of doing this start if you dont attack)

Boom:
The idea of this strat is to be able to hold a rush and after a while easly win because I got more economy to use on army. Its not to sit on my as the whole game and boom, but attack and win in around 20-40f11.

- In my Civ i got:
Infantry - Sword: Attack, Build Time Decrease, Cost Reduction, Hit Points and Speed
Civ - Economy: Farming
Civ - Bldgs, Walls & Towers: Cost Reduction
Spesial Powers: Expansionism
Siege Weapons & Mobile AA - Range

- Build orders:
1. Press H, hold shift and press C (buy 5 citz). Then rally to the wood.
2. Press tab, hold shift and press tap 5 times more and send the citz to iron mine nearest the forage.
2. Press tab, hold shift and press tap 5 times more and send the citz to forage.
3. Press tab, hold shift and press tap 3 times more and send the citz to wood.
4. Pick Civ
5. Press tab, hold shift and press tap 2 times then press B (buy 1 barrack with 3 citz)
6. Press tab, hold shift and press tap 2 times then press B (buy 1 barrack with 3 citz)
7. Choose 2 citz on iron to make Town Center.
8. Choose 2 citz on forage to make Town Center.
9. Buy Swordsmen and hold control + 1 (so you can easly buy new swordsmen, just press 1 then S).
10. Then make as many citz, 3 towers and 4 houses as fast as you possible can.

Remember to never stop making citz (use both TC and the Capitol), make 2 farms fast. Start on 2 new iron mines and make as much barracks around ur base as you can (both defence and you get faster Swords). And make a temple for Gods sake! (Too many people have died because of a firestorm when they Sword Boom).

I hope this helps, and please leave a comment on what you think of both my civs and my starts! : D
you know advanced mining lets you have 7 citizens on mines rather then 6 maybe ive missed your point of having it.
from what i see you dont put that into perspective, if its a late term thing then i find it very unnessicary but thats why its yours and not mine. :)

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Re: My Middle Sh Aoc Swordstarts with Hotkeys

Post by h0llygh0st »

The civ you have now for rush is exactly the same as I have been using for all these years on EEC now and the one I posted on the MW forums all those years ago Kazter :) You should have known it by now instead of letting Omega tell you ;)

Your start is almost the same as well although I do use 9 citz for barracks, take 6 off and let them hunt and than use 4 citz (Capital keeps producing citz) to tower, than I make 3 citz more and put my capi on my patch... This gives me more food earlier on which is usefull if you get a tribute or you need to pop a settle quickly incase someones rushes you. In anyway food is always a more usefull resources than iron.

But I like your tactic since its very similar to my own :)
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Re: My Middle Sh Aoc Swordstarts with Hotkeys

Post by Hello0 »

i would say if ur very fast with mouse and hotkeys etc, 3x 3 cits @ barrack is the best so that u can finish them at same time
if ur slower 2,3,4 is better

but i will try that 2,3,3 start & btw i use exactly the same civ :D
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Re: My Middle Sh Aoc Swordstarts with Hotkeys

Post by PeLlE »

2 , 3 , 3 is imo the best start ;)
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Re: My Middle Sh Aoc Swordstarts with Hotkeys

Post by Omega »

h0llygh0st wrote:The civ you have now for rush is exactly the same as I have been using for all these years on EEC now and the one I posted on the MW forums all those years ago Kazter :) You should have known it by now instead of letting Omega tell you ;)
I've been giving people that civilization since before the MW forums existed. :P
h0llygh0st wrote:Your start is almost the same as well although I do use 9 citz for barracks, take 6 off and let them hunt and than use 4 citz (Capital keeps producing citz) to tower, than I make 3 citz more and put my capi on my patch... This gives me more food earlier on which is usefull if you get a tribute or you need to pop a settle quickly incase someones rushes you. In anyway food is always a more usefull resources than iron.
hello wrote:i would say if ur very fast with mouse and hotkeys etc, 3x 3 cits @ barrack is the best so that u can finish them at same time
if ur slower 2,3,4 is better

but i will try that 2,3,3 start & btw i use exactly the same civ :D
You guys are using a total of 9 citizens to make your barracks?

You start with 20 citizens. Unless you are retarded, you send 12 of them to iron mines at the start. 20 - 12 = 8. 8 is less than 9.

Why are you waiting for your first citizen to be produced before starting your barracks? OR, alternatively, why does it take so long for you to start on your barracks (you should have them started way before that 1st citizen is produced)?

2, 3, 3 is vastly superior to 3, 3, 3 for starting. 2, 3, 4 sounds like the most inferior possibility yet...

If you're very fast and capable of multitasking extremely well, I'd even suggest that often 2, 2, 2 can be superior to 2, 3, 3. (You use the two you "saved" from building the barracks to lure both of your hippos/seals.)

If you do it correctly, it'll barely make a dent in your starting speed and you'll be able to boom a bit better.
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Re: My Middle Sh Aoc Swordstarts with Hotkeys

Post by Hello0 »

fang's start is also a possibillity, as far as i know it works like:

civ-->3x 1 cit @ barrack-->iron etc.....

and he gets them up at f11 0:50 o__o aaaw

@omega: idk if u play much AoC mid but in today's AoC mid u can rush 70% of the players succesfully with ur barracks up in f11 1.20-1.30
so nvm about ur 2 sec u win with using 2 3 3 or whatever .___.

eec may be different...no idea....but in the eec mids i've played i just couldnt hold i also could rush some ppl with that 2 3 4 >_>
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Re: My Middle Sh Aoc Swordstarts with Hotkeys

Post by h0llygh0st »

Omega wrote: I've been giving people that civilization since before the MW forums existed. :P
Very possible but all civs i use are created by myself :) So no glory to you on that account :P
Omega wrote: You guys are using a total of 9 citizens to make your barracks?

You start with 20 citizens. Unless you are retarded, you send 12 of them to iron mines at the start. 20 - 12 = 8. 8 is less than 9.

Why are you waiting for your first citizen to be produced before starting your barracks? OR, alternatively, why does it take so long for you to start on your barracks (you should have them started way before that 1st citizen is produced)?

2, 3, 3 is vastly superior to 3, 3, 3 for starting. 2, 3, 4 sounds like the most inferior possibility yet...

If you're very fast and capable of multitasking extremely well, I'd even suggest that often 2, 2, 2 can be superior to 2, 3, 3. (You use the two you "saved" from building the barracks to lure both of your hippos/seals.)

If you do it correctly, it'll barely make a dent in your starting speed and you'll be able to boom a bit better.
Hmm, first thing I do is hit capi, shift + c, than I chose civ, 2 cizt on a rax 3 on a rax 4 on a rax, make settles and than wait a mili sec for my rax to finish and they always finish at the same time =/

Perhaps you ought to obs me to see that it is infact possible. I might be a tad slower but I can assure you that you wont notice much when facing me ;)
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