J2/Soul's Tutorial for Middle Ages.

[Arntzen]

So a friend of mine from GameRanger made this tutorial, I asked him if I could post it here and he said ok.
He's may known for some from the Liga 1v1 tournament under the name J2.

http://www.youtube.com/user/MidknightsE ... XCO3vCPrBE

Tell me what u guys think of it

[Eisregen]

to much boom.
slow sword pimp/army mass

[Arntzen]

Good reply. I agree, tho this "guide" was to show the idea of the swordstart, and how it's done.
If he wanted to show "best sword start" or "perfect sword start", that wud be the name of the video.

[snupi]

Why is he making towers instead of a wall around his base? A wall gives way more protection and is always the better choice.

[Omega]

Why is he making towers instead of a wall around his base? A wall gives way more protection and is always the better choice.

No.

[lightnessking.]

Snupi why are you born anyways? Such a waste of valuable sperm, maybe someone could have used that sperm to bring a smarter kid to mother earth.

[Ghost]

Towers give more protection and are almost always the better choice.

Fixed

[lightnessking.]

Towers give more protection and are almost always the better choice.

Fixed

Hehe Thumbs up.

[snupi]

Well you see even with towers the enemy can rush in and kill some citizen, and you can only make 4 towers so its hard to cover both mines, food patch, farms, animals and wood cutters. Towers are no big deal for swordsmen or cataphracts due to their heavy armor.
But with a wall, the enemy can not sneak into your base and eco kill you. If he is knocking on the wall you have enough time to react and bring your army in position. If you don't have enough army you can still repair the wall from behind or make a second wall. With towers the enemy can always do suprise attacks so you always need some military units in your base but with a wall you can go full out and have enough time to go back to your base if you are being attacked. Also with a wall in team games you will have enough time to request help from your allys but with towers you have no time the enemy will just rush in and destroy everything.

Thus you see my argumentation wins and you will realise that a wall is better for protection.

[Omega]

Well you see even with towers the enemy can rush in and kill some citizen, and you can only make 4 towers so its hard to cover both mines, food patch, farms, animals and wood cutters.

You don't ever make 4 towers. (OK, so there are some very rare occasions where 4 towers are better than 3 towers + houses/partial wall, but we don't need to consider those here because they almost never occur)

You make 3 towers. Then you make houses, and/or a partial wall. Houses are fantastic, because they make your dudes harder to kill.

When placing towers, you put them in intelligent locations. You don't tower a farm, because when you're making towers you shouldn't have a farm. You tower the most easily hit areas of your base, and place the towers in such a manner to maximize the deterrence factor for people raping your citizens. In addition to placing towers intelligently, you do the same thing with your settlements...

You don't just make towers and expect 3 of them to magically protect your citizens. You have military units--use them.

Towers are no big deal for swordsmen or cataphracts due to their heavy armor.

Towers are a big deal for swords, at least small numbers of swords. And they're a PITA for medium amounts of swords as well providing that you've got some units in the area.

Cataphracts? Seriously? No one makes or uses them, and they get raped by towers. People don't even use them on GameRanger (except I use them there sometimes as a joke on noobs), and I've buffed the shit out of them there. They're just a bad unit.

But with a wall, the enemy can not sneak into your base and eco kill you. If he is knocking on the wall you have enough time to react and bring your army in position. If you don't have enough army you can still repair the wall from behind or make a second wall.

If your opponent is good, they rush you. If they rush you and you're making a wall, you never finish the wall, loose the wall citizens, and loose additional citizens because the only deterrence factor is your army. Then you're down economically, and they eventually crush you.

You're right that walls have value... They're just not more valuable than towers in early game, because in early game towers help you not die, and walls help your opponent kill you. You'd be a fool if you didn't end up making a wall by late game though, because, shockingly, one can indeed mine stone in games!

With towers the enemy can always do suprise attacks so you always need some military units in your base but with a wall you can go full out and have enough time to go back to your base if you are being attacked. Also with a wall in team games you will have enough time to request help from your allys but with towers you have no time the enemy will just rush in and destroy everything.

You can't build the stupid wall. You can build the towers. The towers that you build help you to defend. The wall you don't finish doesn't help you to defend, it just feeds your opponent some citizens. When you don't finish the wall, you have to focus a lot more on defense than you would have had to with towers.

If you're playing the game properly, and so are your allies, you shouldn't have issues with suddenly being surprised with an attack you cannot fend off. You and your allies should have known or suspected it was coming, and be able to react quickly.

Really, from your post it sounds as if you have no idea what the differences are between early game, mid game, and late game. You also don't understand what a rush is, and how/why it's effective, otherwise you wouldn't advocate the wall.

I mean really, if I'm rushing someone, with swords or otherwise, there's NOTHING I'd rather see than them attempting to build a wall around their base, because at that point it's practically a free win for me.

Thus you see my argumentation wins and you will realise that a wall is better for protection.

Walls are shit early game. Towers are good early game. Walls get better as the game goes on. Walls are so bad early game that if you make one, you're BEGGING to be raped by any competent rush.

Basically, your "argumentation" doesn't win. It epic fails.

[Arntzen]

Cataphracts? Seriously? No one makes or uses them, and they get raped by towers. People don't even use them on GameRanger (except I use them there sometimes as a joke on noobs), and I've buffed the shit out of them there. They're just a bad unit

Ye fucked up liga :O

[lightnessking.]

Cataphracts? Seriously? No one makes or uses them, and they get raped by towers. People don't even use them on GameRanger (except I use them there sometimes as a joke on noobs), and I've buffed the shit out of them there. They're just a bad unit

Nino uses them in aoc >_>, his awesome Knight + cataphract mix, after f11 20 some balista's, longbows, crossbows & longswords mixed in... lol.

[Eisregen]

nino lose vs pilliums.

[Ghost]

Cataphracts are a Dark Age unit and therefore they generally fair worse in Middle Ages. End of discussion.

When you are prone to a rush, the only time it is feasible to build a wall is when your map already gives you adequate protection with several large clumps of trees, cliffs, and/or capitol placement towards a corner. The gaps can be filled very quickly and cheaply, making it low risk for your citizens.

Also, if you build walls and you have an opponent who is CA, they can just shoot over the walls if you don't make your base big enough. Towers offer a good amount of protection early on before they get range upgrades.

[[-Ts-] Tricky]

aw gd old mid rush is easy to defend against anyway i remember on eec mid sh when ppl tried to rush against me and other nice mid sh players and we just played the start as defensive and countered. I perfer defending a rush then using the extra swords i have 2 rape pockets but thats me i aint played it in yrs

O yea i love people who makes walls makes my eco rapeing much fun specially when they leave a hole in wall LOL then they acuse you of cheating cus you got through wall lol happy days mid used to be